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 6.) Other Prophets and Prophecies
 Mayan and Hopi Prophecy
 December 21, 2012
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Posted - Aug 09 2003 :  2:18:39 PM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
December 21, 2012 is said to be when the Mayan calender expires. After that, i Think was mentioned to be a dawning of a new era. Can anyone shed some light on the subject.

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Posted - Aug 10 2003 :  12:09:45 PM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
No problemo.

Most civilisations have their own method of measuring TIME...a calendric system usually, and the Maya were no exception, except perhaps that their Mayan long count Calendar, is actually more accurate than the Greorian calendar we use today. From my hazy memory they used tuns and Baktuns or somesuch.

Getting back to other civilisations - most all of them have some "end times" prophecy, not unlike the Mayans.

The Egyptians did as did the Incas, the Hebrews etc all had their own end times prophecy...

Many have taken this in a pretty litteral sense, over the centuries and donned the ol sandwich board proclaiming "repent now, the end is neigh"....

Why would one measure time?

I mean we all do it, - we measure Earths motion thru space in it's eleptical orbit about the sun, from the second right up to days weeks months and years.

We have an almost morbid fascination with time - when will it "run out" for us and we go to meet our maker, when will the bus get here?..

Watching the watch doesn't make the bus get here any earlier - it gets here WHEN it gets here and not a second before YET we insist on measuring that duration of our annual orbit down to the poofteenth of a second because we have a preoccupation with time, as well we should IMHO.

Time waits for no man,
A stitch in time saves 9,
Just in the nick of time,

(Who the heck was Nick anyway and whats he got to do with time?). Who has the spare 'time' to ponder THAT conundrum!!! ;o)

Time - I think you'll agree we are all fascinated with time and mankind has been since time immemorium.

If you read the first 3 pages of the welcome thread started above bye VJ that you just posted too, you'd have seen that TIME is just a form of energy like all other energys in the universe that CAN be converted from one form to another and do work for us in the process.

M = Δ T


"Mass equals Change in Time"...if you prefer it in it's long written/spoken form.

THIS IS what the Mayan long count Calendar is referring to, the SAME thing all the other various civilisations prophecy has referred to..the "time of the end!"..

Ohh scarey, 'the time of the end', 'the end is comming, repent now for the end is neigh'.

BUT - The end of WHAT????????

Scarey, because EVERYONE infers 'the end of life on earth', or 'the end of the earth'...everyone equates the "time of the end" with death - the extinction of mankind, when in fact they are all DEAD WRONG.

Don't lose track now - were almost there..

What was "Time" to God?....Time was nothing - time was meaningless,
a Year was but as a day to God,
according to the Bible...but WHY?

Heres your answer to your original question...DE.

Whats comming is not the time of the end - BUT:-

Ta dahhhh

the END OF TIME...

What does that mean????????

Well, consider this. What if God had mastered ALL of the energys of the universe and what if that very fact is what Made God.."GOD" (Master over everything in the universe).

So God is some 'sentient being' who has mastered all forces in the universe including TIME - this would mean would it not that to GOD - time was meaningless - he could travel back or forth thru time as it pleased him and change the outcome of something if he decided it wasn't the outcome he wanted - bye going BACK in time, and altering the appropriate circumstance, and the the future outcome would be then be different...

So...think about this now, if MAN were to conquer TIME...would we not then have no need to "record time" any further in the form of a calender or watch????.

In effect, Time for us, would be meaningless, we could flit back n forth thru time as we pleased, we would have no need of a calender or watch we would just move back n forth to whatever point in space / time continuum we wished to spend some time - in effect to alter the future bye altering circumstances and thus outcomes...

In effect we would become fods ourselves.

Isn't that what prophecy declares will happen t us at the end of time (time of the end) that we will ascend into the heavens and rule with God over the whole universe?

Isn't that mankinds whole purpose here on Earth afterall?. Te be perfected such that we might be capable of ruling as a God over those in the Universe who havent yet conquered "time" and are hence moribund to some heavenly planetary body on it's elipital orbit abut some other Sun (Star) somewhere else in the universe????

The measuring and more importantly recording of time would become an irrelevance...keeping time and calendars would have no purpose.

Are you beginning to see - why the Maya saw no need for a calendar beyond Dec 21, 2012....

Because at that point in time MAN conquers TIME and the recording of time in Calendric manner becomes an irrelevance. Man becomes perfected such that he is FIT to ascend tto the heavens in order to Rule with God.

Unfortunately - the WAY mankind does this is thru Nuclear Holocaust....converting the MASS of the entire earth into a pure form of energy known as TIME.

The MAYA knew this - those who taught the Maya (the Gods) knew the universe and the method for us who hadn't conquered time, to measure our passage thru space as a calendric system, they knew we would have no need of a caledric system as of Dec 21 2012..because THAT is the End of Time (not the time of the end as so many today erroniously believe).

If time is the Earths Motion thru space in it;s annual eliptical orbit about the sun and Man destroys the Earth by turning iot's Mass into another form of energy thru Nuclear Holocaust...then the Earth will cease to orbit the sun and so our perception of TIME will cease.

Time will be no more because Earth will be no more in the energy form of MASS as we know it now. Earth will become ANOTHER energy form in Space as will we along with it.

Between Now and then mankind conquers Mass and then Time...

It started with Albert Einstein...and his theory of relativity (no - not his "never loan munney to relatives" theory) but his special theory of relativity...

E = MC 2 (Energy = Mass times Speed of Light Squared).

Not so long ago - only a relatively few years in fact, another genious, one Tom Beardden, proposed another theory with regard to energy.

Tom Bearden did a LOT of work of the Scalar Potential - free energy from the Vacuum of space.. You can read all about it on his website at:-

You must be logged in to see this link.

Tom proposed his theory...about there being as much energy compressed within TIME as what there is compressed within MASS.

When we split the atom (MASS) we got Nuclear energy and used it to wipe out Hiroshima and Nagasaki at the end of WW2.

Tremendous amounts of energy from something so small - we can't even see it...with the human eye - a proposal that back in the dark ages would have had you killed as a heretic...

Today Nuclear power is a fact - powering citys and air craft carrier battle fleets and submarines and nuclear war heads and used in medicine etc etc etc.

We all believe today that there can be so much huge amounts of energy (nuclear energy) compressed within Mass (the atom). Instead of like years befiore 1944 when it was science theory now it's a science fact.

Beardens theory went...

E = Δ TC2 (Eee Equals Change in Time x the speed of light squared).

Your respondent here Ol Barney (AKA FRED) Flint-trubble took a good look at Beardens work and even wrote to him (bye the modern marvell of email).

You see - what I noticed was that Beardens Theory told us something about TIME as it relates to Energy

I ALSO Knew that ol ALbert Einstens Special Theory of Relativity, ALSO told us something about the relationsghip of ENERGY and MASS.

I got to wondering of these two theorems since they BOTH told us something about 'energy' couldn't be "resolved" mathematically in some way, to tell us something about the relationship of TIME TO MASS.

As it turns out I was right!!!

Heres the proof.
E = MC2 (Einstein)


E = δ TC2 (Bearden).


MC2 = Δ TC2

Which further resolves to

M = Δ T

or Mass Equals Change in Time

I then wrote to Tom Bearden with my new GRAND UNIFIUCATION THEOREM (GUT)...(copy below) and this is what he had to say (Again Copy below).

"Tom Bearden (by way of Creon Levit)"

Dear Sirs,

Please forgive me emailing you direct from Australia, I am not a scientist, but have been wanting to ask a question for so many months since reading Mr Beardons papers on scalar electromagnetics on the internet that I just have to try to satisfy my need for an answer to my question.

My question relates to the relationship between Mass & Time, and arises from considering the implications of Mr Beardons
Theorem?...that E=DeltaTC2 (Ee = Delta tee cee squared) and Albert Einsteins theory of relativity E=MC2

It occurred to me that since we have two theorys with regard to Energy that they could possibly be resolved mathematically...


E=MC2 (Einstein)
E= Δ TC2 (Bearden)

Then it follows that

MC2 must = Δ TC2

That being the case they can be further resolved that

M = Δ T
(Mass = Change in Time)

Am I wrong in my assumption please? and if not - what are the "implications" for science, of M = Δ T ?

This has been puzzling me greatly since I read about MEGS (motionless Electromagnetic generators) etc...and being a layman tried to follow and understand all of Lt. Col Tom Beardens papers on so many subjects...

I had many years ago (1970's) read some of Stan Deyo's works on plasmoidal induction, anti gravity etc, and specifically the
information about the speed of light not necessarily being a constant, which it seems recently scientists are more and more
comming to realise.

Mr Deyo's solar tea cup analogy for explaining the presence of a "space ether blanket", being dragged thru space at a rotational velocity aproximating that of the earth, as an explanation for the observed results of Mitchelson Morleys (and later Mitchelson Sagnacs) rotational analogue experimental results with the speed of light have always fascinated me, and have made me wonder when we will ever really understand fully the speed of light, and it's relationship to time and mass, gravity etc...

Sorry for not being very technical or scientific, as I explained, I'm no scientist, in fact I failed my upper school physics and chemistry subjects badly (but managed to marry the cute blond gal I sat next to in 21 years of marriage & 3 wonderful children later I figure I didn't do too bad afterall! ;o)

I really would like to know if I've got it all wrong and if not and it's right - what it means??

Sorry if it's a dumb question, I'll understand if you don't have the time to answer me....consider me just an inquiring mind I guess...

I'm wondering (to myself) if / what the implications might be for example of Megs, and anti gravity, plasmoidal iinduction etc etc for marine vessel propulsion specifically...I figure after mankind has
sailed the seas since Noah's time and probably before - there simply
MUST be a better way bye now (the 3rd Millenium) to propell a vessel
than sail, propellor or water jet, air fan etc..

It seems to me it should be possible with unlimited free electrical energy in the form of a MEG, and a vessel hull (alloy) immersed in an electrolyte (saltwater ocean) that plasmoidal induction might possibly be achievable?...

I figure, If I can crack that first - I'll work on anti gravity next!!

In the interim...have I managed to discover anything with M = Δ T ?...or am I barking up the wrong tree please?

Cheers n beers from downunder & many thanks in advance should you be able to reply at all.

Most sincerely yours,

Barney trubble etc

This was Lt Col Ret. Tom Beardens reply..

Dear Barney,

The question certainly is not a dumb question!

To first order, time seems to have the same energy density as mass does. Here's how to look at it.

Suppose you take some spatial energy (in 3-dimensional space) and compress it by the factor c-squared. That's a whale of a lot of compression, something on the order of 9x10exp16.

So what can you do with that piece of highly compressed energy?

If you just leave it in 3-space, it is what we call "mass".

If you remove it from 3-space and place it over on the 4th axis, that is over on "ict" where the only variable is t. So the only place it can fit is in "t". There it is called "time".

So time is actually highly compressed energy.

In quantum field theory, they even recognize a photon that is "polarized" on the time axis. That is, its energy is oscillating on that fourth axis, as a slight compression and rarefaction of time itself.

For simple work and understanding, it boils down to a second being some 9x10exp16 joules of EM energy, removed from 3-space and compressed into time.

It then follows that, if you "decompress" a little time into spatial energy, you will get enormous joules of energy (i.e., 9x10exp16) for every second of time you transduce into 3-space energy.

Remember, energy can be change in form, between any two forms, at least in theory.

So by "using a little time", one can produce enormous EM energy in space, in spatial circuits.

It turned out that all 3-space energy comes from the time domain anyway, being time converted into 3-space energy. And it also returns from 3-space back to the time domain, in an ongoing "circulation" in 4-space. That is decidedly not taken into account in the present physics!

What actually changes is the very notion of "propagation" of energy through 3-space. Actually, nothing can move in 3-space a priori; if it moves, it has to move in 4-space instead.

Best wishes,

Tom Bearden

So in answer to your question DE...

What is happening here is that people like myself and Tom Beardon and a heap of others are working with a NEW branch of physics to crack the energy compressed within Time...

Toms working on specifically Scalar energy... and I'm working on manipulating mass into time and time into mass.

My suggestion to you is that "we" (or someone else on this planet) will be successful in doing so in the next few years between now and Dec 21 2012, at which point Time and the calendric mechanism of measuring it will become irrelevant.

That will be "The End Of Time" (as distinct from the "time of the end" so may mistakenly prophecy!!!).

There you have it in a nutshell - and you heard it here first from Ol Barney Trubble...the discoverer of the "Grand Unification Theorem" (of the universe) that Einstein died looking for.

When I (we) conquer Time - we will be as gods - masters of the universe.

"Use the force Luke!" Ohh Bee Whan Kan Obee Starwars Jeddi Knight..

And what force was that?...TIME!!!!!!

Yabbadabba - fun eh? ;o)

Edited by - Barney Trubble on Aug 10 2003 12:47:45 PM
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153 Posts

Posted - Aug 11 2003 :  11:03:13 PM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Welcome DE:

Of late, I am having a hard time analyzing too much as to when the "end of time" comes. Certainly, as Barney says, it will come when it comes. Funny I should be the one to say that, since just before "of late", I was searching and searching through (Biblical) prophecy to try to understand it to search for where we are in time.

IMHO, I believe Revelation is almost complete, but I also don't believe Revelation is a moment-by-moment script. I think it jumps back and forth. First it may complete a grand scheme and then moving back and completing certain things in more detail.

I believe the rest of the prophecies that need to be fulfilled will be found throughout the entire Bible. Yes, entire, because it seem so me, we all seem to be living one big parable, each of our lives exampling one thing or another as well as each of our communities, nations, all of us as one race (on earth) seem to example one thing or another.

It seems to me that these "examples" ("parables", "prophecies") all come about in timing (such as what Mike's web site attempts to show). Additionally, it seems to me that there is going to be a time when all these examples line up precisely so that this Age will end and the New one will begin.

How can I say such things? All through out time, everyone has claimed a prophecy has been fulfilled and the end is near. Yet, later, another occurrence in time seems to match yet another prophecy. It's as if all the prophecies happen over and over, AND on a regular cycle. It seems to me that there is ONE great cycle for which all prophecies occur and in that last "day", we will witness the coming of the New Age as all prophecies run through their last cycle.

I don't know if this makes sense to anyone, for my description of what's floating around in my head don't really make it down on paper as I mean mean.
Funny, one of the reasons why I replied to this post was to mention to Barney that his stuff is interesting to read, but for someone like myself, WAY TOO LONG. But one must say what one must say. Then I look at what I've write and wonder why I can't just make a quick answer.

"No, Do, or do not. There is no try." - Yoda
"Always the student I am, never the teacher." - Me

Edited by - VJSchmidt on Aug 11 2003 11:05:59 PM
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82 Posts

Posted - May 03 2004 :  03:38:55 AM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Barney, VJS, we become what we think about.

I think we are already God. Us When Now Forever together in love New One Us.

As you think then so I am, my consciousness has unlimited potential, you realise it for me, thus the "I" in "U" is "US"

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1174 Posts

Posted - May 04 2004 :  06:34:35 AM  Show Profile Send Conor a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One could also say that God exists because of our conscience, we created the Creator. When as a species millenia ago we could rationalise and think for ourselves we first looked at the world around us and in some way ofr us to understand it at our primitive level we decided a supreme being or manifestation created it for us.
These sorts of philosophical and theological debates will rage from now till eternity and none of us will truly know until our lives expire.

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Posted - May 05 2004 :  7:26:43 PM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
new one you walk on hollow ground.

there is no substance in your words.
no basis
you strive for a man centered belief/religion because it is easier to handle. when it takes you away from where you need to be.
you are a walking my firend
in the wrong direction.

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Posted - May 06 2004 :  08:22:03 AM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thank you O Humble1 for your attention.

It only appears to be a man centred belief when we appear to be man. There are worlds into which you can be born where man does not exist yet you are a self searching for belief to work for your existence.

As for the words, that is all they are unless you get behind their meaning. Substance, like all reality is slippery at the best of times. Belief can make solid from hollow and hollow from solid. Only you know what you experience and if it works for you then it must be true (for you).

As for the right or wrong direction, as Shakespeare said it is only thinking that makes it so. The wrong direction from your point of view, yet you have not the privilage of my vantage point.

Edited by - New One on May 06 2004 8:22:41 PM
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Posted - May 07 2004 :  11:02:56 AM  Show Profile Send Conor a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Mmmm sounds far too theological for me. I prefer to think through simplicity.
I think therefore I am.
God thinks therefore we are.
I think therefore God is.
Those three little sentences make up a strong part of my belief system. There would be no God if there was no one to worship God, and there would be no universe if there were no God. So its like one great big philosphical cycle that we wont find out until we are dead! No ones belief system is better than an others. Humble One your beliefe is different from mine and from New Ones but that does not mean we all dont have credence in our beliefs. This sort of back biting rubbish starts religious wars!

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Posted - May 09 2004 :  01:01:16 AM  Show Profile  Visit mm2001's Homepage Send mm2001 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
New One appears to have bought into the idea of the "Over Self." Was this Jungian too or Scientology?

Anyway, some forms of gnosticism agree with this idea, but I'd be careful with this belief: The "overself" could end up having two horns on his head, cloven hooves, and a pitchfork. LOL
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Posted - May 09 2004 :  3:01:32 PM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
This has always been the great fear in believing in ourselves Mike. Far better to put God in charge, taking responsibility for ourselves is too difficult to bear. God is the boss, anything against his wishes must have come from the one downstairs.

Primitive thinking to my mind. We have evolved to the point where we are understanding so much more about ourselves and our unlimited potential. Keeping the fear factor in place is like the Victorians belief that if we travel faster than 15 miles per hour we will suffocate. This was proved incorrect as is the idea that belief in yourself takes you down the road to fire and brimstone.

We are the captains of our souls and the masters of our own destiny.

All prophecies are self fulfilling. Whatever you focus your mind on expands. What do you want to see grow, death and destruction or human beings reaching new levels of self expression and acheivement?

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Posted - May 09 2004 :  7:59:21 PM  Show Profile  Visit mm2001's Homepage Send mm2001 a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well, I can only reiterate: Satan is the greatest humanist and humanitarian on earth, and a great deceiver too.

How does one know if that 'realisation of one's full potential' and any grand sence of self-actualisation and self-empowerment, not to mention an overwhelming and joyous feeling of oneness with nature and with all of humanity, is not the magic of Lucifer at work, formerly God's chief angel?

How does one distinguish or discern all that is learnt?

Not all prophecies are self-fulfilling: the holy prophecies are as written into stone as is our past history. I believe God can temporarily postpone them, or mitigate them to some degree for certain people, but they shall happen.

"What do you want to see grow, death and destruction or human beings reaching new levels of self expression and acheivement?"

Of course I would PREFER to see the latter choice, but I EXPECT that both shall happen ... as they always have. Destruction and creation walk together on the same path.
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Posted - May 10 2004 :  07:36:16 AM  Show Profile Send Conor a Private Message  Reply with Quote
New One I repsect all that you are saying and believe most of it. But I do believe in a God. But I think that we have been given self determination so we can rule our lives to bring the knowledge to God at the end. I think God may be a child as our universe is still quite young and maybe God is learning along with us. So lets give God a break, God has a lot of work to do in keeping a universe in order! LOL!

As for Satan well Satans greatest strength is to get us to believe that there is no satan or to blame it all on God.

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Posted - May 11 2004 :  09:28:34 AM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi guys!
It 's been awhile. All of these philosophical thoughts and feelings gives one something to ponder one. Thank you.


Jennifer Ward

Knowledge ... the small part of ignorance that we arrange and classify Ambrose Bierce
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165 Posts

Posted - May 11 2004 :  09:35:29 AM  Show Profile Send n/a a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hi guys.
I don't know much about the Mayan calender. Did the Mayans take into account variations in time, such as Leap years?


Jennifer Ward

Knowledge ... the small part of ignorance that we arrange and classify Ambrose Bierce
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1174 Posts

Posted - May 12 2004 :  05:51:13 AM  Show Profile Send Conor a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I believe they had a very true calender that didnt rely on years as we use them, but theirs was based on lunar and solar cycles, and they also knew the relation with mars and venus positions in the sky. Their calendar was extremely accurate. Pretty much down to the minute. According to their calendar the phase on earth that they were part of will end on December 21 2012. So we will just have to wait and see!

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Posted - Oct 08 2007 :  2:30:25 PM  Show Profile Send Drago a Private Message  Reply with Quote
( I just had to bring up this discussion :D. )

Well, the mayan calender is indeed very accurate, even more accurate than the one we use nowadays. Their knowledge about the universe was astounding, sadly we only had four tablets left of their knowledge thanks to extremist christians who thought their glyphs were actually the work of satan, so had to be destroyed.

Thankfully though some monks apparently managed to 'rescue' four of these glyphs and luckily they contained very valuable information.

December 21 2012 is dated into the mayan calender as a time of change, like many previous events. These events were based on the Kathun prophecies which would repeat every 260 years time. (kathun 13 was the spanish who came in their empire).

All these Kathuns had their own text, for instance that of Kathun 13 was:

This is a time of total collapse.
everything is lost.
It's the time of the judgement of god.

and so on.

And so to say, december 21 2012 is a date that takes place on the cycle of a kathun.

The kathun we have nowadays is kathun 4 which begins in 1993 and will end in 2012, on december 21.

Now this kathun is very special because it's text describes the 'supreme deity' to return to earth and make the start of a new age. In other words, a new cycle begins.

Now december 2012 is a very special cycle, because this is according to the long time calender (there were actually 3 calenders in one which made it insanely accurate) For the mayans, according to the long time calender there are 5 cycles, of which 4 have already passed and the last one is about to aswell. One cycle lasts 5125 years.

All the previous four cycles seemed to have ended in destruction, so it is believed the fifth cycle will also end in destruction and end of time, because it is the last cycle.

Now I think by many this is wrongly understood, because the end of time wouldn't nessecarily mean the end of the earth. Rather I'd say it's the beginning of something totally new.

December 21 2012 is also a date on which our sun supposedly aligns to the center of our milky way

Because this was such an important date they even put the roots of their civilization atop of it and had a story that would go togheter with this event.

The popal voue, or well the mayan bible said the dark rift in the universe is actually the place in which evil grows and comes out of it, the comfy home of satan. And this is the spot with which the sun will align. on december 21 2012.

The story with this happening (named "The hero twins) is that the 'first father' (i'll call him god.) got challenged by the lords of the underworld to a game, god accepted the challenge traveled to the underworld and suddenly the underworld boys withdrew their challenge and decapitated god. His sons, the hero twins got angry and defeated the lords in an epic battle, after which they resurrected first father.

Now that story with that date is the thing that interests me the most, if you look at Nostradamus' prophecies you have two keyfigurines which greatly decide the outcome of world war 3, supposedly also in kathun 4's dates. These two figurines, would be Chiren, and also mentioned Ogmios.

Chiren and Ogmios supposedly were the ones who defeated the Antichrist (There are speculations of there being multipile antichrists, so let's say "The lords".) And try to bring the world in prosperity and good.

Now surely I'd say this just can't be coincidence. Is december 21 2012 the decisive date of world war 3 and the end of "the epic battle" from the popal voue? And supposedely the start of the whole new cycle? I don't know, all I can do is guess. But it surely does interest me.
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